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 Super Caps and Flagships
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| Dramicus |
Posted on 17-09-2005 23:54
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 Posts: 15 Joined: September 17 2005 |
Now I know that there is an upper limit to the size of vessels which HW2 permits, however I would like to know approximately how large ships can get before they either become impractical from a game play perspective or impossible from a coding perspective. Atm there are some modestly large ships within the rosters, but nothing larger than a vayger city ship. I was wondering whether we would be seeing the addition of *large* battleships and/or carriers in the future. Something similar in size to a city ship or possibly larger is more or less the scale that i am referring to, essentially ships which dwarf all others which are currently available. If this would provide problems in gameplay, IE: the damn thing is too big to manouver. then that would be understandable, making the only remedy to either keep a certain size limit or increase map sizes. Ive been reading through the manual and have noticed that liberty has been taken with the HW2 fluff and entirely new additions made. I am not entirely familiar with what is planned, so if the apperence of large ships does not fit with the fiction then a short explanation would be great. Most of my space combat views and ideals come from Warhammer 40k. Anyone who knows even a little about Battle Fleet Gothic and Imperial fleets will know that a 5 km long ship is considered small with battleships and carriers reaching titanic sizes while remaining more or less realistic. and as a side note, how big approx. are the ships in PDS? a few numbers would be greatly appreciated. Edited by Dramicus on 17-09-2005 23:55 |
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| TelQuessir |
Posted on 18-09-2005 06:20
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 Posts: 2598 Joined: August 30 2005 |
"Realistic" is only relative to how far you can justify the reasons for designing and building vessels of their respective scales. |
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| MarieHawke |
Posted on 18-09-2005 06:42
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 Posts: 501 Joined: September 02 2005 |
Ship sizes can be found if you use the move tool and move the waypoint-adder-thingy (can't think of a good name for it LOL) to the bow of the ship. Bam, instant half-ship-length. That said, the Prince of Hiigara (Deliverance BV) is about 800 meters long. That's about 2625 feet for you Imperialistic people (pun intended) Pride of Hiigara (Mothership) is about 2500 meters (8210 feet) high. EDIT: I was thinking 2.2 ft = 1 m. Apparently I am Flawed Thinking Redefined. XD Edited by MarieHawke on 18-09-2005 06:53 |
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| Warman1 |
Posted on 18-09-2005 08:25
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 Posts: 146 Joined: September 08 2005 |
One thing you could do to make the ships seem bigger, though this might have an odd effect on gameplay (not to mention probably be alot of work), would be to make all the other ships smaller while increasing map size. |
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| Dramicus |
Posted on 18-09-2005 18:26
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Posts: 15 Joined: September 17 2005 |
lol Hawking, thats a great idea... cant believe that it never crossed my mind.  @Warman: I thought of that as well and like you said, it would probably cause a whole new list of problems as the scale would have to be adjusted not only for size but speed, weapon effects and the view distance would also put a damper on that. It would simply be easier to keep the current scale and simply make something bigger. |
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| MarieHawke |
Posted on 18-09-2005 21:01
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Posts: 501 Joined: September 02 2005 |
In any case, for roleplaying purposes, the ship lengths are as they appear on the waypoint circle and all weapons ranges are 1m = 1km for a bit of realism (!??!?!!. I still think 10m = 1km. With this range we can have bombardment coming from an Earth radius away.) EDIT: 1 Earth radius, not half an Earth radius. Flawed Thinking Redefined! Edited by MarieHawke on 18-09-2005 21:01 |
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| shiny_darkness |
Posted on 18-09-2005 22:09
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Posts: 14 Joined: September 10 2005 |
On a less relevant note, The SSD executor from warlords is approximently the size of a normal hw2 map (bow to stern). Granted that ship is a fleet in itself and is total overkill (the thing can be fighting several battles at once, just because it stretches over the whole map). The point is ships like the battlestar could be fairly larger if a reason came to light. While I'm sure PDS will never have ships like the SSD, like it or not thats a good thing  . |
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| Thorin |
Posted on 18-09-2005 22:50
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 Posts: 414 Joined: September 02 2005 |
I don't think there will be any ships much bigger than cruiser-class. The battlestar is an exception, not the rule. If we get into stationary units, those might amass to unprecidented proportions, though. |
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| TelQuessir |
Posted on 19-09-2005 00:37
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Posts: 2598 Joined: August 30 2005 |
Because a space station doesn't need to survive forces of acceleration and some other commonly overlooked basic points of engineering. |
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| Thorin |
Posted on 19-09-2005 02:35
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Posts: 414 Joined: September 02 2005 |
However, to compensate for lack of maneuverability, they either have to be set into hard things like asteroids or be large in scale. Pricey as compared to cycling patrols and mobile shipyards. |
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| Dramicus |
Posted on 19-09-2005 21:16
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Posts: 15 Joined: September 17 2005 |
but they would also have enough fire power to make a titan of fire sweat before going up against them...
"The warrior who acts out of honour cannot fail. His duty is honour itself. Even his death - if it is honourable - is a reward and can be no failure, for it has come through duty. Seek honour as you act, therefore, and you will know no fear." - Robute Gui
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| Thorin |
Posted on 19-09-2005 21:30
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Posts: 414 Joined: September 02 2005 |
Space is big. You can just go around them Of course, there is no better way to protect shipyards, prison compounds, and intelligence centers. |
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| Enkidu |
Posted on 19-09-2005 23:56
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Posts: 5 Joined: September 12 2005 |
This can't happen in PDS with limited ranges, but in reality, attackers could just hurl munitions at a stationary target (no way to dodge!) from long ranges, easily dodging any return fire, and wait for a lucky hit on their target. A fleet accelerating in system could launch projectiles fast enough to make interceptions very hard or impossible, so any truly stationary fortifications wouldn't work very well. On the other hand, a station that could shift a couple kilometers one way or another would make bombardment a bit more difficult. |
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| TelQuessir |
Posted on 20-09-2005 00:28
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Posts: 2598 Joined: August 30 2005 |
I believe I have stated this fact many times already: "Long" range in PDS fiction means 6000 km, which is respectable (1m = 1km transation from game to fiction). The in-game scale is simulated - as no one is going to design a battle management interface of that magnitude with truescale icons. That's the point of roleplay which your brother does. Edited by TelQuessir on 20-09-2005 00:28 |
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| Enkidu |
Posted on 22-09-2005 11:46
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Posts: 5 Joined: September 12 2005 |
I'm aware of the scale in PDS; my post was simply intended to discuss the weaknesses of unmoving fortifications against extremely long range combat, say cross-solar system engagements. I don't think we have those in PDS, , it was simply a discussion of theoretical problems. Sorry for any misunderstandings.  |
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| schumador |
Posted on 22-09-2005 14:55
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 Posts: 70 Joined: September 21 2005 |
I would love to see a super-ship (Vagyr) using two Shipyards as side-pods (like the Battlestar Galactica), turned on their sides with the cap-ship facility perpendicular to the central hull. This would very much be a motherclass-ship. As for the Sobani, maybe dig up the mothership from Cataclysm and mod it a bit? Like jam a BCV into it, with the front-and-back ends keeping the original mining-ship look... what was it called, the Kunan-Re? That massive space station that you need to retrieve Capt Soban from in the SP campaign - I wonder if that could be modded to give it some mobility.... Last but not least - where's the Beast?? Turanic Raiders? Kadeshi? What I'm referring to is some random encounters, like the Antarans in Master of Orion II? Is this a little far-fetched within the PDS universe? I can dream!! |
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| MarieHawke |
Posted on 22-09-2005 17:13
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Posts: 501 Joined: September 02 2005 |
eww, Vaygr Monitor-carrier. Just... no. A similar idea has already been shot down. The Battlestar is probably the biggest ship anyone might see in this game. I'll let the others elaborate about the other races/viruses. (But for what, I say, FOR WHAT? XD) A starlight sharpshot magical girl!
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| schumador |
Posted on 22-09-2005 18:55
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Posts: 70 Joined: September 21 2005 |
An additional race of pirates or mercenaries - the way they build their fleets is by piecing together chunks of derelict hulks and captured ships... The ships would be ugly, come in different sizes and shapes. |
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