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 Proposed scenario - HGN Fighter Weapons School (Like top gun)
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| HappySacks |
Posted on 24-10-2005 11:32
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 Posts: 56 Joined: October 24 2005 |
Hi all, I've started monkeying around with map making for PDS and I'm wondering if anyone would be interested in a series of missions focusing on strikecraft tactics, based on the US Navy Fighter Weapons School a.ka. 'Top Gun'  I'd like to set the mission up so that you only control the fighters. You'll launch from a carrier to intercept a wing of bombers with escorts coming to 'sink' your carrier and larger escort vessels. With the mission design, I'm taking inspiration from the WWII battles in the pacific, films such as 'The Battle of Midway' and 'Top Gun'. Open for comments! HS. [i]"O Maker, help us to cover their smiling fields with the pale forms of their patriot dead; help us to drown the thunder of the guns with the shrieks of their wounded, help us to lay waste their humble homes with a rain of fire; help us to wring the hea
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| Ironwatsas |
Posted on 24-10-2005 13:02
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 Posts: 856 Joined: October 21 2005 |
If only you could FLY the SCs...:rolleyes: |
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| HappySacks |
Posted on 24-10-2005 13:18
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Posts: 56 Joined: October 24 2005 |
A 'Wing Commander' like experience of PDS.... that would be cool but in my perception isn't really in the scope of what PDS is trying to acheive. I'm thinking more about directing multiple squadrons of varying types of fighter sized strikecraft. The kinds of missions I have in mind are any typically found in the 'Wing Commander' games. escort this, defend that, scout this area, scramble! etc... you get the idea.. If only I could figure out how to make enemy ships attack my ships by default. At the moment I'm using the Duel gametype as it doesn't spawn any ships by default. I might copy it and use it for a template for a 'Strikecraft scenarios' gametype if thats ok. Edited by HappySacks on 24-10-2005 16:15 [i]"O Maker, help us to cover their smiling fields with the pale forms of their patriot dead; help us to drown the thunder of the guns with the shrieks of their wounded, help us to lay waste their humble homes with a rain of fire; help us to wring the hea
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| TelQuessir |
Posted on 25-10-2005 00:54
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 Posts: 2598 Joined: August 30 2005 |
Quote A 'Wing Commander' like experience of PDS.... that would be cool but in my perception isn't really in the scope of what PDS is trying to acheive. You can make copies of the fighter flights so they are smaller thus more suitable for wing commander scenarios. It is for these tiny-scale engagements that I want a corvette sized drone carrier modelled. Individual dueling of small craft is also entertaining to watch, and attack frigates totally dominate such a field. As this thread is a duplicate of the other you posted in the Port, let me know which one you're going to use. Not both. Edited by TelQuessir on 25-10-2005 00:55 |
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| HappySacks |
Posted on 25-10-2005 13:06
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Posts: 56 Joined: October 24 2005 |
Use this one for wargaming, the other one for fluff based on the real life 'TOP GUN' I posted in here to discuss basing the missions for HGNFWS on real life scenarios and I guess this is where I need the most input. I posted in the RP forum to check to see if the concept was inline with fluff. I'm going to post heavily tweaked research on the USN Fighter Weapons School in the RP thread I started after I've nailed down the flow of the mission here. I felt this was the best place to discuss the balance of a scenario. I'm a bit new at using discussion forums so tell me if I've cocked up! these are some real life scenarios where modern carrierborne aircraft intecepted threats against a friendly naval asset. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulf_of_...a_incident I found the scenarios based on real naval battles to be the most enjoyable so I'm going to try and reproduce a fun PDS version of events. I'm quite new to mission editing and am trying to find a mission editing tool that doesn't crash on me and supports all the ships in the PDS mod. I find notepad more robust! However, between all the editors I've got I can make a map, thanks to the MissionBoySE and Skunk editors. I think I'll start by just modelling a scramble situation, enemy bombers and light interceptors inbound to attack the carrier, you control squadrons of interceptors and heavy fighters to knock them out before they do any damage to your carrier's engines. Managing the logistical challenge of keeping your fighters operational as they become more and more damaged will be most interesting. I think you can land strikecraft on allied carriers so that solves the issue of giving the player somewhere to land, repair and rearm. I'm waiting for some feedback at http://forums.relicnews.com/showthrea...ost1198105 so I can set the enemy AI to attack the player as soon as the game starts, regardless whether or not the player is within sensor range. If I can do that, then the rest is pretty easy. Quote You can make copies of the fighter flights so they are smaller thus more suitable for wing commander scenarios. I might be up for reducing the size of fighter wings once I've got a bit more experience under my belt - I wonder if I could specify squadron sizes in a gametype so as to not upset the balance of normal PDS games.... Edited by HappySacks on 25-10-2005 13:09 [i]"O Maker, help us to cover their smiling fields with the pale forms of their patriot dead; help us to drown the thunder of the guns with the shrieks of their wounded, help us to lay waste their humble homes with a rain of fire; help us to wring the hea
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| TelQuessir |
Posted on 26-10-2005 01:16
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Posts: 2598 Joined: August 30 2005 |
That's why you take my suggestion, make copies of the ship folders and separate fleet deployment from the wing commander gametype. Mission editing tool - use notepad. |
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| HappySacks |
Posted on 26-10-2005 20:38
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Posts: 56 Joined: October 24 2005 |
Couldn't have asked for better timing to get into PDS scenario making. That new carrier is perfect for what I've got in mind. Rock on. Thanks for the suggestion, I'll give it a crack. Edited by HappySacks on 26-10-2005 20:42 [i]"O Maker, help us to cover their smiling fields with the pale forms of their patriot dead; help us to drown the thunder of the guns with the shrieks of their wounded, help us to lay waste their humble homes with a rain of fire; help us to wring the hea
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| TelQuessir |
Posted on 27-10-2005 00:06
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Posts: 2598 Joined: August 30 2005 |
For any scenario more complex than a duel, plan out the coordinates for the forces disposition on paper. There is a HW2 map editor available, let me see if I can find the link for it. |
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| Old Crusty Commodore |
Posted on 15-11-2005 17:17
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Posts: 62 Joined: September 07 2005 |
Why not make it real wing commander like who can forget the first time his ass was shot out of the midway.... turn around and gaze upon her splendour(with 3dfx:thumb  in short will these scenarios feature a fleet carrier in its standalone force projection role? Weather aint neutral....
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| Old Crusty Commodore |
Posted on 24-11-2005 09:08
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Posts: 62 Joined: September 07 2005 |
^ ^ what none of you played all the wing commanders............? Pfffffffffff bunch of barbarians Weather aint neutral....
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| TelQuessir |
Posted on 28-11-2005 00:02
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Posts: 2598 Joined: August 30 2005 |
NGCS has no carrier ops yet - instead frigates are employed as attachments to capital ships, with Lavis docking to cruisers for resupply. They have their own hyperdrives so no mobility problems. JTF 21 featured in Beta 1 has a rather unique force structure - 40+ frigates in two wings with a heavy group of 9 cruisers at its core. OOB graphic here: http://www.hwshots.hwaccess.net/v/pds...b.jpg.html Edited by TelQuessir on 28-11-2005 00:02 |
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| HappySacks |
Posted on 29-11-2005 23:31
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Posts: 56 Joined: October 24 2005 |
This rocks. I'm going to hold out until carrier ops make it into NGCS, the campaign sounds wicked.
[i]"O Maker, help us to cover their smiling fields with the pale forms of their patriot dead; help us to drown the thunder of the guns with the shrieks of their wounded, help us to lay waste their humble homes with a rain of fire; help us to wring the hea
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| TelQuessir |
Posted on 30-11-2005 00:33
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Posts: 2598 Joined: August 30 2005 |
Help me with concept writing and see it release faster  |
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| Old Crusty Commodore |
Posted on 30-11-2005 16:34
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Posts: 62 Joined: September 07 2005 |
what do you need done
Weather aint neutral....
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| HappySacks |
Posted on 30-11-2005 18:42
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Posts: 56 Joined: October 24 2005 |
How about a distress call from a space station on the fringe, non-combatants, the carrier group has to provide humanitarian relief (evacuation?) while come under attack from local vagyr warlord crusades, possibly for some thing important that the HGN wont know about until later. Just spitballing here. [i]"O Maker, help us to cover their smiling fields with the pale forms of their patriot dead; help us to drown the thunder of the guns with the shrieks of their wounded, help us to lay waste their humble homes with a rain of fire; help us to wring the hea
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| TelQuessir |
Posted on 30-11-2005 23:02
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Posts: 2598 Joined: August 30 2005 |
Like virtually 99% of all concepts in games and mods nowadays - way too grand. By implying that it is an event that develops into a full scale slugfest later, it puts a lot of stress into the development cycle. I've always favoured the "common grunt" in my modding work and while NGCS doesn't do anything but Red Flag exercises now the key is in how that is presented, not how chrome-plated the concept is. Too much shinyness and the product becomes a crude (albeit shiny) and useless piece of third rate junk. |
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| HappySacks |
Posted on 02-12-2005 15:46
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Posts: 56 Joined: October 24 2005 |
I agree. I should have explained myself more clearly. Elements of the story don't need to be scripted to that level. I think that you could just place a space station (under control from a third allied player that has no other units), set the vagyr to attack player 3 and place the HGN just out of sensor range. Objective is to protect the starbase. I don't know how difficult this is to do or if it is a sound concept, but I place it here for review by my peers anyway. [i]"O Maker, help us to cover their smiling fields with the pale forms of their patriot dead; help us to drown the thunder of the guns with the shrieks of their wounded, help us to lay waste their humble homes with a rain of fire; help us to wring the hea
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| yasotay |
Posted on 02-12-2005 21:25
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 Posts: 637 Joined: September 09 2005 |
There are in essence three mission types: attack, defend or delay. Of the three it has been my experiance that 'delay' is the most difficult to successfully execute. Attack is the next most difficult as you must make and adapt a plan on the fly as your actions evolve against an opponent who while ceading initial initiative to you is able to react most likely with a better understanding. Obviously defence is the more simple of mission type. That said we should remember the famous paraphase of Clausawitz - In war all things are simple, but the most simple is exceedingly hard. |
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| HappySacks |
Posted on 03-12-2005 12:22
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Posts: 56 Joined: October 24 2005 |
perhaps a good start would be to model one of each mission types? In my previous post I stated that i think (in my limited experience, please don't hit me) that missions involving starbases do not have to be complex to write. So, combining the 'distress call' idea with yasotay's 'three type rule' we could have the following. Mission 1 - Strike - HGN TF has to destroy enemy fixed asset, be it starbase, disabled ship etc..... Mission 2 - Defend - Shortly after the successful attack by the HGN TF thay RX the distress call from the SB, get retasked and move ships to defend against vagyr attack. Mission 3 - Delay - give evacuation transports time to get out of harms way. We don't need a great deal of scripting, most of the story can be inferred by roleplay text and clever placement of ships and megaliths in the map. For example, I created a starbase defence mission last night just by altering the starting fleets and giving myself a duel_observationpost. I've written few mission maps, I've made assumptions based on my limited experience. Edited by HappySacks on 03-12-2005 12:25 [i]"O Maker, help us to cover their smiling fields with the pale forms of their patriot dead; help us to drown the thunder of the guns with the shrieks of their wounded, help us to lay waste their humble homes with a rain of fire; help us to wring the hea
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| Itharu |
Posted on 03-12-2005 20:08
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 Posts: 363 Joined: September 23 2005 |
I believe I proposed a similar scenario about a month ago along those lines.
-Fear the Might of the Imperial Cortharian Fleet
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